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This is long, I'm really sorry. Any wisdom would be appreciated.

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  • This is long, I'm really sorry. Any wisdom would be appreciated.

    RomanceDictionary.com
    Hi everyone.

    I am "stuck", in a way. I am 30 years old and I would be so appreciative for anyone's help.

    My HS friend, who is 3 yrs older, and I had a special platonic friendship where we would go to concerts together since we liked the same bands. From the ages of 19-21 we did not see each other at all because I studied abroad and he graduated college and was in the military, but we would send long email updates every month-2 months or so.

    In 2009 I had returned from studying abroad and he was deployed. We wrote eachother and something chatted consistently with a webcam over 6 months. From the moment he came back from being deployed we were together! We were very much in love - we had fun, travelled together, had an joyful, supportive relationship, friends and family came to stay with us. We also discussed marriage and kids because 100% that's what we imagined for the two of us.

    We had problems: I was less "adult" than him, career and money wise, and sometimes he held that over my head. He would behave inappropriately in public sometimes. He could be insensitive. We fought semi-often. But they were productive fights usually but some issues would reoccur and its like he wasn't learning things from them.

    In the span of our 2-2.5 yr solid relationship, we would live together for 3-5 months at a time, but we'd have to deal with long distance as well because I went back to school and he would be deployed. I always wanted to have a profession and to pursue my own passions and have a shared life, not just sacrifice me to be with him (which is what I then thought the army forced me to do).

    As a child of divorce, I had issues I didn't even know about let alone know how to address. He had his own issues too, like everyone. His dad was very macho and sometimes was mean to his mom despite the fact that their marriage was great and they were best friends, the mom didn't have a full independent life or anything.

    I felt a need to explore other people, to learn something, something wasn't making me happy, but also, I didn't know how to make myself happy (that's what I needed to learn - N couldn't account for everything!). I told N I wanted to take a "break" in 2012, which devastated him. He was living on a military base in the US at the time, going through a lot of stress on his own.

    After that things were bad. He got out of military, he moved nearby, but refused to live with me, we would fight all the time, we would date on and off, had trust issues because he caught me lying about being with other people while we were on a break, and I caught him lying about sleeping with other people without a condom, and we would just blame each other and become critical of each other. It was very sad but also neither of us knew what we were doing, I hadn't the faintest on how to productively solve a big issue. We would try once in a while because we both were attached to the great memories. Also, its probably orth mentioning, this coincided with me and him going through our own wild phases. Him getting out of the military (honorably) and rediscovering his civilian self, going on motorcycle trips, starting to go to EDM parties and do mollie a lot, smoking weed, and for me, joining a band (I'm a musician), smoking lots of weed, kind of abusing adderall because I was working, going to school and being in a band and it was prescribed to help me concentrate. Once or twice our fights got violent (me scratching/hitting him) partly because I was on adderall and my nervous system was so jacked up. And this is NOT something either of us take lightly at all.

    I started therapy which really helped, I began to sort out my feelings and identify my issues and change things. I tried to get him to go to therapy a few times, but he didn't make an effort. Then, after years of this nonsense, in 2016, at the age of 29, I got desperate and contacted this relationship therapist, a woman who wrote a book about taking a break to reset the relationship, who talked to him a total of twice on the phone. She basically said he loves you but he's holding a grudge, he is using the grudges to avoid growing up and maturing, and that he has narcissistic tendencies and has a slight lack of empathy which is a problem. I knew this but it helped to hear someone else confirm it. I wanted to up-level together and clear all the debris and get to the root of things so that we could enjoy eachother again.

    He is better than me at detaching himself. When I would push him to grow up and make it work he became mean and cruel, he would put me down, he was insensitive to begin with, but his behavior during this revealed a true problem with being empathetic. When we were together he spent most of his free time with me (and I with him) without me needing to ask or anything. But now he prioritized hanging out with everyone except me - he stopped respecting me, once I even did mollie with him to prove I was fun, but I got a panic attack and he got mad that I ruined his fun. He was NO WHERE NEAR what I imagined he would be like at the age of 32. He was in med-school at this point and would tell me, "stop putting pressure on me, stop controlling me, maybe YEARS down the line we can, etc." He would also be pretty cruel to me (since he was so angry). I read a few books that actually said he was angry because he was abusive, not the other way around, and that made sense. Also, It was me calling HIM 90% of the time, texting him, because I was convinced the whole thing was my fault because I had initiated it, and I had lied about being with other people while being broken up (to protect HIM, ironically). He would say things like "youre dishonest! I can't trust you! You are a child! You are too needy/controlling!" and after much deliberating with friends, my therapist, and reading, I can certainly say that despite messing up a few times, I am NONE of those things. Everyone makes mistakes, and I think it was his grudge talking, but deep inside he must know that I'm a regular person that learned from my mistakes, since it is the truth.

    So there are a couple ways I look at it:
    1)Part of me was aware that I shouldn't try to convince or cajole him, because it damaged my self-respect and esteem everytime he would reject me, I thought I was doing the noble thing because ultimately my goal was to have him join me in doing hard relationship work
    2) He would sometimes say things like, "I miss you" and "I'll always love you but I don't like you".

    Cut to now: it is 2018. I am 30, he is 33, going to be 34 in June. All of our mutual friends are getting married and having kids, and we are both finishing our respect graduate schools this year. I have no idea what the next year will look like, other than that if my friends and family stay healthy and alive, it should be good and exciting.

    We haven't spoken since July, and before that, March. I called him. I have a boyfriend who is younger - he's funny, sweet, kind, emotionally healthy, but he isn't N. He is absolutely a great person and I love him as much as I can love anyone that is not N. What's interesting is that all the work I did from the breakup with N has made me able to be a better partner than ever before. I am in the emotionally best place Ive ever been. My relationship with my parents is good, I am doing well in school/work, and I know that I'm kinder and more empathetic toward everyone. I have no idea what N is thinking. I know he was dating some younger girl for a while but he broke up with her.

    The advice that resonated with me most, that didn't make me feel guilty or crazy for still being attached despite everything, was to act "as if" we will never get back together, and the universe will take care of the rest. Do the right things and the universe will set things right, whatever that means. All I know is despite how bad things got I have never felt a bond with anyone the way I did with N. I am behaving and acting as if it is 100% over for me and N even if I still feel this lingering connection.

    Im fine but I still cry when Im alone sometimes because I still love him. Part of me knows that the way he and I acted was also a result of us being in our 20s, figuring things out, and maybe meeting each other before we had relationship skills. Because I knew him for so long, I can't help but feel like I know he's better than that.

    If I can make a relationship work with someone I am less crazy about with some basic skills, I can only imagine how things would be different if N stepped up to the plate and decided to work on things.

    Anyway, I'd love feedback from anyone who has been in this situation. I feel like I would love to move on, to be done with this, to just stop thinking about him and just be like, "whatever whatever hes my EX" but I feel like I cannot control it. Whenever I picture the dad to my kids its him. Whenever I picture growing old with someone it's been him, for years. I just want to stop driving myself crazy, bc even if it seems like its not holding me back, it MUST be.

    Also, I feel like if I could get into his head and 100% know that he was over and done with me and doesn't think about me or is HAPPIER without me, than I truly think I would accept it and finally move on, internally. Since externally I have moved on.

    Someone knock some sense into me please!
    Last edited by msjolunden; 02-17-2018, 07:29 PM.

  • #2
    If you have moved on externally, then you can move on internally as well. The fact is that you have suffered too much in this relationship. You deserve something better.

    The best way to move on internally is to keep yourself engaged with meaningful activities.

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    • #3
      A good person is described as someone who can play ball with you. If you throw them the ball, they catch the ball and throw it back to you and you catch the ball and throw it back to them.

      Reciprocity is present. The relationship works smoothly.

      The "clueless" person is someone that is aware they are playing a game of catching ball with you, but when you throw the ball towards them, they are looking the opposite direction. When you inform them that you threw the ball their direction and they missed it, they immediately apologize and begin looking for and retrieving the ball.

      They find the ball and throw it back to you and you both resume playing ball with one another.

      The "difficult" person can be described as one wherein the previous scenario occurs. Instead of "catching on" to how the game is played, however, you spend a lot of time teaching, reminding, and reviewing how to play the game on frequent occasions.

      A "toxic" person is one who looks directly at you, sees you're about to throw the ball, stands there looking blankly at you, you throw the ball, the ball drops to the ground, and the toxic person looks at you like you're ridiculous and says, "Didn't you see I wasn't ready?"

      You respond by going over and chasing the ball apologizing that you didn't see they weren't ready. You resume to play ball and the same scenario happens again and again.

      You say you want to play ball. That means ball games, not head games! Is it possible with narcissistic emotional abusers?

      When you decide you want to go play with someone else, it is then that the toxic person engages and plays a few rounds of ball successfully catching and throwing the ball back and forth with you. The toxic person, however, soon returns to the same initial way of playing ball when you begin to become comfortable playing catch with them.

      This cycle continues for years with the toxic person never figuring out how to play catch for any length of time the way normal people play catch because one of two reasons. One reason is that they don't want to play ball the way you want to play ball or the second reason being that they simply can't play ball the way the normal game of playing ball is played.

      Ask yourself what kind of game of ball catching would you prefer playing? Have you ever played catch with someone who really knows how to play and can read how you can catch and then throws the ball in a way that feels good for you and works?

      Or, are you so used to chasing dropped balls with your partner who never seems to "get it?"

      There comes a time when you will realize that for once in your life you'd like to really play ball instead of scrambling after balls that not only fall on the floor, but most of time fall in places you really don't want to put your hands.

      Perhaps an important choice to consider would be to think about playing ball with a different person while you still can.

      There is a video on "YouTube" by "A Gossamer Heart" with a slide showing a picture of a young child evolving to a middle-aged woman and to a mature-aged woman. Similarly to the video, look at the stress lines in your face and begin to realize that those lines are there to stay and that the years existing in a relationship that is everything but satisfying are gone.

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      • #4
        Thank you both. I have suffered too much. Everytime I write something out like this though I feel better, like acknowledging all my sadness and frustration allows me to let go a little more. And when I recall everything I remember that there is no way I would ever go back to being with him unless he changed his attitude completely, and that hasn’t happened and probably never will. This isn’t a huge tragedy - no one died. As long as two people are alive choice is involved and he has made the choice to not repair a thing. His loss.

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        • #5
          RomanceDictionary.com
          Also, I really liked your ball playing analogy. Never thought Of it that way. I think he is a mixture of clueless, difficult, and perhaps even toxic.

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